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Unreal Engine 5 Revealed


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Just now, PK said:

This all looks great, but don't they clarify at 1:40 that these are the film production versions of models & textures and so games won't actually look quite this good? Or have I misunderstood that?

 

It's pretty much the opposite, they were saying that to show off. They've basically taken these models straight from the asset store and bunged them into the engine without it complaining.

 

They probably aren't literally "film quality", although with Unreal seeing increasing use in film and TV production (see The Mandalorian) maybe they could be forgiving for arguing that doesn't mean assets that need a server farm to render.

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Very impressive and easily the  best/first look properly at what next gen games might look like. I take it the fast bit at the end is made possible using an SSD? 
 

Imagine what the next Ueda game will look like on PS5 PS6 :(

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41 minutes ago, RubberJohnny said:

Oh apparently it's 1440p/30fps so don't expect stuff to look like that after all?

 

It's using a temporal upscale to 4K (very few games are going to run at a raw 4k, everyone is going to be using upscaling / reconstruction techniques) and... well... when exactly wasn't 30fps the primary target for console games? Seems pretty representative of what developers are likely to be targeting tbh. Maybe with the advent of HDMI 2.1 you'll be able to unlock the frame rate in some games that otherwise target 30fps, and see where that gets you.

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This is the most impressive tech demo I’ve seen in years. The “nanite” tech specifically. If it’s using geometry textures like they’re hinting at on twitter then that’s really cool. I really hope they explain how it works!

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18 hours ago, RubberJohnny said:

 

Someone linked the PS4 version and it looks really rough, actually:

 

 


 

oh my. It does look rough. I take it back. 

 

Christ, games might actually look like in the OP?! Wow!

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5 hours ago, MemoryLeak said:

This is the most impressive tech demo I’ve seen in years. The “nanite” tech specifically. If it’s using geometry textures like they’re hinting at on twitter then that’s really cool. I really hope they explain how it works!

 

'Geometry textures' sound a lot like displacement mapping. I'm assuming there's a difference somewhere,  it's presumably more efficient and the tessellation happens later in the render pipeline or something.

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Yes, I think they’re similar, but geometry textures are much more powerful. In that rather than being used to add some dimples to an existing polygon mesh, you strip the mesh back to a cube and put all the geo in the texture. I’m not sure how they’re doing it, my guess is there are never any triangles tessellated, it’s raytracing the geometry  textures in some way instead (not rtx style raytracing, just in the pixel shader) while rasterising the proxy geometry. Could be totally wrong though. 
 

I LOVE the idea of having geometry in a filterable representation. Mipmaps are so nice for textures, it would be great to have geometry behave the same way.

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Some interesting details here about how well or otherwise the demo runs on current PC hardware:

 

https://wccftech.com/unreal-engine-5-demo-is-rendering-at-1440p-most-of-the-time-on-ps5-rtx-2070-super-could-run-it-at-pretty-good-performance/

 

Bit of a no brainer that it does run in some form on PCs, because otherwise how would they have made the thing. But you do need an high end graphics card (one that likely costs as much as the new consoles will, on its own) and a pretty bleeding edge SSD (probably one of the ones that comes with its own chunky heatsink). Even then it sounds like the SSD in the PS5 is some way ahead of anything you can actually buy and put in a PC today. Not sure if this is because of the SSD itself, or the architecture around it (e.g. the proprietary compression tech).

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As a tech showcase it was really impressive but it means very little for actual games. I am surprised I have seen people and press declaring it "the new PS5 graphics". It will be almost impossible to see a proper game with this fidelity and all that the demo includes.

 

Many games which use the engine will certainly benefit from the new amazing techniques but this is a tech demo, nothing more. Maybe Naughty Dog or Rockstar have the resources, people, time and "working hours" available to create something close to this at some point, although we are still waiting for the real tech demo of UE4 to be achieved as a whole, while it took an entire generation for the PS2 tech demos to become reality.

 

I am not an expert, this is simply an opinion from some general experience.

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Interesting stuff from Sweeney in the Eurogamer interview:

 

Quote

Temporal accumulation, you know - more than just normal temporal anti-aliasing - it's is a huge part of how we're able to make things look as good as this," says Kim Libreri. "The global illumination, without a temporal intelligence, there's no way you could do it on hardware yet. We're actually doubling down on the understanding of how temporal can help us, and there's been so many huge improvements in quality because of having a temporal component. It's the way that we get close to movie rendering - without those samples (and they're not just necessarily pure screen-space samples, there's loads of things you can do to temporally accumulate), the GI would not work anywhere near as well as it does without it."

 

From the sound of this UE5 renders the global illumination pass at a low frame rate (be interesting to know how low). Then, using motion vectors to warp the image into the correct position, it reconstructs the missing frames. Clever stuff but there's possible issues too, temporal warping is likely to produce artifacts in certain conditions and anything that involves temporal accumulation will very likely involve a degree of latency too.

 

Edit: that or UE5 renders GI at very low samples and then uses temporal techniques to warp then average the GI - massively improving render quality. Even clevererer.

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1 hour ago, Talk Show Host said:

As a tech showcase it was really impressive but it means very little for actual games. I am surprised I have seen people and press declaring it "the new PS5 graphics". It will be almost impossible to see a proper game with this fidelity and all that the demo includes.

 

Many games which use the engine will certainly benefit from the new amazing techniques but this is a tech demo, nothing more. Maybe Naughty Dog or Rockstar have the resources, people, time and "working hours" available to create something close to this at some point, although we are still waiting for the real tech demo of UE4 to be achieved as a whole, while it took an entire generation for the PS2 tech demos to become reality.

 

I am not an expert, this is simply an opinion from some general experience.


Did you listen to the guys talk or just watch the demo? 

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29 minutes ago, Talk Show Host said:

 

Why do you say that?


Just in relation to your point about man hours, they talk about easily bringing in hi quality assets from the Megascan library which could free up devs to spend their time elsewhere?

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24 minutes ago, Sarlaccfood said:

Just in relation to your point about man hours, they talk about easily bringing in hi quality assets from the Megascan library which could free up devs to spend their time elsewhere?

 

But then you've got the art director of God of War saying the following

 

sg1r9y395py41.jpg

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1 minute ago, RubberJohnny said:

 

But then you've got the art director of God of War saying the following

 

sg1r9y395py41.jpg


Yeah I assume they won’t use it for everything but it’s another time-saving string to their bow I imagine.

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Yeah for rocks and stuff you could bring in stuff from the Megascans library, but that's not a new feature - you could do that already in UE4.

 

It took 24 people 6 months to make a five minute section, I don't think that scales to 30 hours.

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I watched this in 1080p, and it looked fantastic. I was bothered about having to upgrade my gaming tv as I still use a HD Sony Bravia, what does this all mean? There’s not many 8k or hdmi 2.1 TVs around, so I guess everyone is cool without them? Does anyone really know at this point?

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There's a new Digital Foundry video that does into more (but not full) detail of how Nanite and Lumen work. I'd say it's an approachable video with clear examples of what's different about Epic's approach.

 

 

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Is there a reason that Microsoft and Sony don't do this themselves? Surely they know their consoles better than anybody and could make the best game engine possible, allowing developers to get the absolute best from the machine to show it off? 

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