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Down by Law

Neill Blomkamps..... ROBOCOP!

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On 12/07/2018 at 15:08, mushashi said:

The stuff Blomkamp does on his YouTube channel has neat visuals so he is definitely talented on that front, probably not enough to really make a classic film though.

 

On 12/07/2018 at 16:40, RubberJohnny said:

I can't believe yet another nostalgia reboot by a shitty director has gotten pages of excited praise, what number of times is this that you've fallen for it rllmuk?

 

I take it neither of you have seen District 9 then? That is an absolute classic and really shows that he’s a talented director. His more recent films haven’t hit that high, but there’s no way he’s shit. He just obviously needs a better writing team to hone his ideas, and it looks like he might have it for this.

 

I think this sounds like a great fit, as long as they can find an angle that captures the mental social commentary of the original. I’m really optimistic.

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I don’t agree.

 

However, the Halo 3 film is like the finest six minutes anyone’s ever committed to film, so it doesn’t matter anyway! :quote:

 

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8 hours ago, b00dles said:

Robocop 2014... It's possibly slightly better than Robocop 2.

 

Robocop 2 isn't perfect, but at least it's entertaining. Chaotic, less emotional, a blunter satirical edge than the original Robocop but still a massively fun piece of action cinema. I get what they were trying to do with the remake, expand on the emotional and moral dilemmas of combining man and machine, but it didn't work. It's an incredibly boring movie.

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1 hour ago, RubberJohnny said:

District 9 is uneven as fuck and only got praise for launching in the middle of the writers strike when everything else was worse.

I mean, it’s cool that you don’t like it, but to say anyone who does, only likes it because there was a writers strike on, is a bit mental.

 

It’s a stone cold classic to me and I had no idea there was a writers strike on when it was made, as I’m sure is the same for the majority of other people who liked it.

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I enjoyed it at the time, but I chalked it up to the writer's strike. Does it stand up now the strike is over?

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I liked the direction they went in with the remake but accept that the finished product was flawed and frequently boring.

 

Anyway, I’ve always pretended that the real sequel to Robocop was Dredd.

 

Maybe now I can pretend that this is the sequel to Dredd.

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You've been posting GIFs of Blomkamp's VFX in this thread but nobody's questioning his visual prowess. I believe we're (mostly, if not all) agreed that his special effects, the look and settings of his films are all interesting and accomplished- it's simply that people will want his interpretation of RoboCop to be substantially more than visual spectacle, "cool" tech and visual setpieces. D9 was enjoyable precisely because it has the best of both worlds.

I quite liked the way that RoboCop 2014 revisited the dilemma of whether or not he was still Alex Murphy, by flipping the concept of him slowly remembering his identity in the original and now having it being actively suppressed to make him colder and more dispassionate, giving him an illusion of being in control when he was at times simply a passenger in his new body. I hope that Blomkamp's pseudo-sequel tackles some of these themes too, particularly if it's going to thematically continue from the end of the original film.

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It's a shame Robocop 2 started interestingly with him following his wife, wanting his former life but when they bring her in to speak to him he brushes her off and acts completely robotic and cold to her. Then the plot point is completely discarded. It will be interesting to see how miner and neumeiers script tackles this, if at all. 

 

Robocop 14 I couldn't get passed the first 15 minutes. Car bomb my ass, 87 worked because Boddiker and his crew were the biggest cunts in movie history and the entire driving force of Murphy regaining his memory. 

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1 hour ago, Down by Law said:

It's a shame Robocop 2 started interestingly with him following his wife, wanting his former life but when they bring her in to speak to him he brushes her off and acts completely robotic and cold to her. Then the plot point is completely discarded. It will be interesting to see how miner and neumeiers script tackles this, if at all. 

 

Robocop 14 I couldn't get passed the first 15 minutes. Car bomb my ass, 87 worked because Boddiker and his crew were the biggest cunts in movie history and the entire driving force of Murphy regaining his memory. 

 

Can you flyyyy, Bobby????

 

Uttered a million times by me and my friends after watching Robocop in the cinema when we were about 14 :D

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23 hours ago, JPL said:

 

 

I take it neither of you have seen District 9 then? That is an absolute classic and really shows that he’s a talented director. His more recent films haven’t hit that high, but there’s no way he’s shit. He just obviously needs a better writing team to hone his ideas, and it looks like he might have it for this.

 

I think this sounds like a great fit, as long as they can find an angle that captures the mental social commentary of the original. I’m really optimistic.

 

Seen it, it's alright. I looked it up on IMDb, 7.9 is a bit higher than I'd personally rate it as the story isn't that memorable. Nice visual imagery, which is usually the quality of Neill Blomkamp that is often cited for why he is a good director. So maybe it would be more correct to call him a very good VFX guy, which is what he was before Peter Jackson gave him his break. But I don't think that is really enough to be a good film director alone. He wrote/co-wrote all 3 of his full length films and the film he cared most passionately about is the one people hate the most, go figure!

 

Compare him to directors who are more widely rated, there is a definite gulf in shown ability.

 

I watched the first of his short films on YouTube yesterday, lots of interesting imagery and world building, but would he be able to sustain that for a full 90-120+ minutes, probably not. He must have made a very good impression on Sigourney Weaver to get her to appear in that.

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1 hour ago, mushashi said:

 

Seen it, it's alright. I looked it up on IMDb, 7.9 is a bit higher than I'd personally rate it as the story isn't that memorable. Nice visual imagery, which is usually the quality of Neill Blomkamp that is often cited for why he is a good director. So maybe it would be more correct to call him a very good VFX guy, which is what he was before Peter Jackson gave him his break. But I don't think that is really enough to be a good film director alone. He wrote/co-wrote all 3 of his full length films and the film he cared most passionately about is the one people hate the most, go figure!

 

Compare him to directors who are more widely rated, there is a definite gulf in shown ability.

 

I watched the first of his short films on YouTube yesterday, lots of interesting imagery and world building, but would he be able to sustain that for a full 90-120+ minutes, probably not. He must have made a very good impression on Sigourney Weaver to get her to appear in that.

Nah, District 9 is brilliantly directed. Easy to follow action, nice use of talking heads style moments, lovely panoramas of the city and the camp. Just really solid directing with a good eye for detail and strong character studies. Christopher Johnson and his son's interactions with Wikus are perfect. The fact that he also wrote it and was instrumental in the VFX just elevates him in my eyes.

 

I think you're letting your own personal opinion of his films cloud you're judgement.

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7 hours ago, Down by Law said:

Robocop 14 I couldn't get passed the first 15 minutes. Car bomb my ass, 87 worked because Boddiker and his crew were the biggest cunts in movie history and the entire driving force of Murphy regaining his memory. 

 

If you've only watched the first fifteen minutes, how do you know that the car bomb didn't work equally as well for that story? Murphy doesn't need that same motivation as '87 because his memories are already retained, he's simply the same man who has been woken into a living nightmare. He has to deal with the suffering of knowing that he'll never be the same person again and has to find his way out of the very human sense of despair that develops from his predicament. How much of him is actually left in there, when even his brain is being held together by technology? He struggles with the full knowledge of being a piece of corporate property from the off and a terrible part of that is knowing that his wife gave her permission for it to happen to him because she wasn't willing to let him go. Oldman has some particularly good scenes, where the moral implications of tricking Murphy into believing that he still has free will are explored. It's not a perfect film but it's a smart(ish) retelling.

 

Let go of your reverence for the original and try to engage with 2014 as its own entity, instead of expecting a facsimile or deciding that it won't meet your expectations after a quarter of an hour. You might be pleasantly surprised.

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9 hours ago, DeciderVT said:

 

If you've only watched the first fifteen minutes, how do you know that the car bomb didn't work equally as well for that story? Murphy doesn't need that same motivation as '87 because his memories are already retained, he's simply the same man who has been woken into a living nightmare. He has to deal with the suffering of knowing that he'll never be the same person again and has to find his way out of the very human sense of despair that develops from his predicament. How much of him is actually left in there, when even his brain is being held together by technology? He struggles with the full knowledge of being a piece of corporate property from the off and a terrible part of that is knowing that his wife gave her permission for it to happen to him because she wasn't willing to let him go. Oldman has some particularly good scenes, where the moral implications of tricking Murphy into believing that he still has free will are explored. It's not a perfect film but it's a smart(ish) retelling.

 

Let go of your reverence for the original and try to engage with 2014 as its own entity, instead of expecting a facsimile or deciding that it won't meet your expectations after a quarter of an hour. You might be pleasantly surprised.

 

Thing is, the original Robocop did all this, and in a more streamlined way. True, it's the other way around, but it's still man versus machine. There are two very small scenes in Robocop that are a real emotional gut punch: the scene where visits his old house and has flashbacks of his former life, which is maybe five minutes tops and the scene where he talks about his family with Lewis -- "I can feel them... but I can't remember them."

 

The remake is reaching for the same impact, but it's just interminable drudge for three quarters of the running time, before remembering it better get on with some sort of story. As for Oldman, he elevates anything he's in, no matter how poor his character is. And his character's pretty poor in the remake, basically a "shouty exposition" guy, right down to commentary on what Robocop is doing (I know what he's doing, I can see it), or explaining complicated themes in case anyone is too dumb to get it.

 

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On 13/07/2018 at 19:33, Monkeyboy said:

 

Robocop 2 isn't perfect, but at least it's entertaining. Chaotic, less emotional, a blunter satirical edge than the original Robocop but still a massively fun piece of action cinema. I get what they were trying to do with the remake, expand on the emotional and moral dilemmas of combining man and machine, but it didn't work. It's an incredibly boring movie.

 

I think people forget with Robocop 2 also, that it was pretty much the pinnacle of stop animation. 

 

 

 

I want this to be as cyber mech bloody as the first two. 

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On 13/07/2018 at 19:33, Monkeyboy said:

 

Robocop 2 isn't perfect, but at least it's entertaining. Chaotic, less emotional, a blunter satirical edge than the original Robocop but still a massively fun piece of action cinema. I get what they were trying to do with the remake, expand on the emotional and moral dilemmas of combining man and machine, but it didn't work. It's an incredibly boring movie.

     

Yeah it really is stultifying boring. And shit. The action scenes are disastrous. Compare and contrast the warehouse shootout with those great angles and rhythm  and that bollocks in the dark with shitty hyperactive editing. CGI 209's that look like total shit.

 

Flavourless, characterless, inferior in every way - performances, direction, script, dialogue, action, cinematography.

 

Straight in the bargain bin.

 

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21 hours ago, DeciderVT said:

 

If you've only watched the first fifteen minutes, how do you know that the car bomb didn't work equally as well for that story? Murphy doesn't need that same motivation as '87 because his memories are already retained, he's simply the same man who has been woken into a living nightmare. He has to deal with the suffering of knowing that he'll never be the same person again and has to find his way out of the very human sense of despair that develops from his predicament. How much of him is actually left in there, when even his brain is being held together by technology? He struggles with the full knowledge of being a piece of corporate property from the off and a terrible part of that is knowing that his wife gave her permission for it to happen to him because she wasn't willing to let him go. Oldman has some particularly good scenes, where the moral implications of tricking Murphy into believing that he still has free will are explored. It's not a perfect film but it's a smart(ish) retelling.

 

Let go of your reverence for the original and try to engage with 2014 as its own entity, instead of expecting a facsimile or deciding that it won't meet your expectations after a quarter of an hour. You might be pleasantly surprised.

 

Nothing happens after 15 minutes. 

 

There's a good thing TWIN PERFECT did in their Silent Hill: Downpour video where they split their review into two parts: the game considered on its own merits with no reference to any other title and the game considered as a Silent Hill game. This was to assuage people who complained that the devs were trying to do something new. 

 

Anyway, the game fails thoroughly when considered from both angles. So does this. 

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3 minutes ago, Smitty said:

 

Nothing happens after 15 minutes. 

 

There's a good thing TWIN PERFECT did in their Silent Hill: Downpour video where they split their review into two parts: the game considered on its own merits with no reference to any other title and the game considered as a Silent Hill game. This was to assuage people who complained that the devs were trying to do something new. 

 

Anyway, the game fails thoroughly when considered from both angles. So does this. 


Apparently I imagined enjoying it, then? :lol:

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2 hours ago, DeciderVT said:


Apparently I imagined enjoying it, then? :lol:

 

Of course not. I'm just explaining that its not hard to consider the film from two different angles; as its own thing and as what it really is (a remake of Robocop) and that I think on both fronts it is a failure as a film.

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On 14/07/2018 at 20:20, JPL said:

I think you're letting your own personal opinion of his films cloud you're judgement.

 

I can only judge how good I think somebody is as a film director based on their released output. I'd only seen the shorts he had done for Unity and the first of his Oats Studios ones and District 9 when I wrote that, and that seemed a fair appraisal of his shown abilities.

 

All 3 have obvious visual flair, so he's definitely top flight in that field as a director, the question mark is over whether he can do all the other things the truly great film directors can do.

 

Paul Verhoeven, Ridley Scott and even somebody more recent like Denis Villeneuve proved they could make good films not reliant on fancy graphics before they went and did fancy graphics films, that is what Neill Blomkamp has yet to still prove imo.

 

I watched the other 2 Oats Studios shorts he released over the weekend, great visual imagery again so expectations for RoboCop 20XX to look great should be fulfilled. I also watched Chappie, a film which doesn't seem to get any praise on here so I had no idea what to expect from it. It was surprisingly rather good and I enjoyed it. Once again, lovely visuals and Chappie himself is brilliantly present in the world, a triumph of VFX. I suppose the main negative is related to how much the rappers get on your nerves, but I didn't mind them. They reminded me of the sorts of criminal people that would inhabit a Mega-City from the future. Shame he won't get to make the trilogy he planned for that character.

 

 

I was surprised to find out that RoboCop 2 was written by a very well known comic book writer and directed by a man who had directed one of the most well regarded genre films of all-time, what the fuck went wrong there?!?

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Samuel L Jackson reprised his XMen role for the new Robocop, it remains a blur in my mind which film it is. Gary Oldman completely wasted. The story that the film maker Jose Padilha tells about making the film made him sound like a puppet artist, Elite de Tropa were classic action films and Im not sure he was able to take the film where he wanted. 

 

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